1957 Anglo American Rally photos

Thanks for the link. Amazingly enough, I was there, but I was only 10 years old at the time, so I don't really remember a lot about it, other than I had a GREAT time. I think I might be in picture #19, sitting on the ground in front of the blue & white trailer. For some reason, I really liked the trailer, and it was an easy meeting place, right in front of the Larz Anderson entrance door.

I'm quite sure that car #3, picture #5 is Ed Roy's 1912 Simplex. It was one heck of a car at the time. I rode in many times. Ed and my father were pretty good friends. Ed made iron lungs for a living. Hopefully you'd never need one of his products, but if you ever did, you wanted one he made. If he did it, you could be sure it was right.

He made a dozen models of the Simplex chassis. They had incredible detail. Things actually worked. I always wanted one, but they were a little out of my league. I wonder where they are now?

Thank you so much for posting those photos! I rarely visit this Forum and I'm really happy I cought the thread title. I've had a program for the 1957 Anglo-American Ralley for over 30 years, and this is the first time I've had a chance to share the info in it. There were teams of cars from the USA and England if you look at some of the photos you'll see a red white & blue plate with a number. These cars are the ones that were in competion on the rally, both teams had 10 cars and one backup car. Using the program I'll go through the photos and identify the car, owner and town they called home and Rally number in 1957. Photo #7 is a 1913 Lozier owned by Thomas Lester, from Chagrin Falls, Ohio, (4), photo #6 is a 1911 Peiece Arrow Model 66 owned by Robert S. Kilborne III Armonk, N.Y (2) photo # 5 is the Ed Roy 50HP Simplex from West Roxbury,Ma.(3) The car was sold after Ed passed on and was rerestored and is now red. Photo # 4 is the Samuel E. Baily 1914 Simplex from Bala-Cynwyd, Pa (5) photo #16 is the 1903 Napier racer owned by George Waterman at the time later sold to Bill Harrah,back in England now I believe.The Mercedes in photo #15 was owned by Mayland Patton from Pennsylvania if my memory is correct.Photo #11 is a 1910 Rolls-Royce owned by S.J.Skinner from Basingstoke, Hants (2) UK Team, Photo # 10 is a 1913 Lanchester Type 38 owned by Francis Hutton, Newbury, Berkshire (3) UK team..............will continue posting later this evening. Hope you enjoy this. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> Bob Swanson

Please share more if you get time. I was pretty sure about Ed Roy's car, but the others escaped me. Some of the names you mentioned are familiar sounding. I was only ten when it happened, so I'm surprised I remember any of it. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />

Hi Chuck, The reason I never finished the posting of the information was based on the date of the original start of the thread. ONE MONTH and I was the first guy to reply and as I stated I rarely visit the CCCA Forum. The AACA Forum is dead so I got bored and went looking for something to read. My first car show was in 1961 at the ripe old age of 10 also, still have the photos I took. Maybe the restored car people don't have computers, I don't know. I'm just glad I like a lot of different Pre 1941 vehicles and found a Hot Rod website Forum that is VERY active. I'll finish posting the rest of the info some night knowing that at least you appreciate reading it and reliving the event. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Hello,

I am the original poster of the photos and have been following the discusion on this list and the VMCCA list. I have been correcting the info on the photos as it comes in so I am thrilled to find someone with a program from the event. I was about 9 when I went to the event and really loved it then.

I'll add your info as soon as I get some free time. As for the program, is it possible that you could scan that and post it as well?

This has been a fun excersize for me and I hope everyone enjoys the photos.

-Jon

Hello Jon, Thanks again for posting those great old photos. Sure is great to see how this hobby was back in the "Golden Years". I did visit the VMCCA Forum and entered a reply as well, i'll try to finish posting the program info later tonight. If anyone knows how to move a post from one Forum to another, please feel free to move mine ftom CCCA to VMCCA and vice versa. Best wishes, Bob

I should mention that the Flickr website allows you to add comments directly to the photos so feel free to do so (though you may have to sign up).

Also, you can view the photos at the full resolution by clicking on the all sizes tab above the photos. This helps in identifying the cars since there is a good amount of detail in the photos.

I scanned them at 2400dpi, which is hopefully enough to get the most detail. I have been considering getting a special purpose slide scanner with higher resolution, but I think this is probably OK.

-Jon

I did notice the Flickr photo ID feature, but I'd have to signup, don't know what effect that has on the computer. Feel free to transfer the info I posted and will post later today. Bob

These pictures are great! I made copies of most of them and sent them to well-known automotive historian Fred Roe (Fred doesn't "computer") for his comments, which he was kind enough to send me. Fred said to use his comments any way I want, so here are some of them for you all to enjoy.

Frank Wemple

********************************

Fred Roe's comments:

[Picture No. 4:] Simplex, Sam Bailey's at the time, later B. Cunningham's as per 1972 Austie [Clark] postcard.

[Picture No. 5:] Ed Roy's Simplex as you realize.

[Picture No. 6:] Pretty sure this is (was) Terry Kilborne's Pierce-Arrow. Yes.

[Picture No. 7:] Is a Lozier of Tom Lester and it was on the American Team in spite of its paint.

[Picture No. 9:] Of course is Austie's [the late Henry Austin Clark, Jr.] 66 [Pierce-Arrow].

[Picture No.10:] Is F. W. Hutton-Slott's Lanchester of the British Team. I think this car was in the Haines collection in Canton, OH, when we visited at the Cleveland [CCCA] Annual Meeting. It was apart, motor out.

[Picture No. 11:] S. J. Skinner [Rolls-Royce] from England - a very well known car - still.

[Picture No. 12:] 3 cyl. Chase.

[Picture No. 14:] Art Mellor (deceased) restored this car. He was from [Rhode Island]. Very dedicated historicaly. Ray Belsito [later restored it again]. Was owned in [Rhode Island] for a long time, but is now Ralph Marano's in New Jersey.

[Picture No. 16:] 1904 Napier racing car owned by George Waterman, shown apparently before restoration completed by Frank E. H. Johnson. Charlie Fisher and I trespassed on an estate in Swampscott to peek in windows of coach house at night to see this car and a BIG 6 cyl. Napier Touring. Both still exist and the racing car went via Rockefeller and Harrah and now back to England.

[Picture No. 17:] 30-98 Vauxhall of G.B. Team - a Mr. Melville, owner.

[Picture No. 18:] Mercer - American Team. Ralph Buckley.

[Picture No. 20:] Paul Cadwell's [Model 30 Packard] - should not have painted the [radiator], or [put on] oversize tires.

[Picture No. 21:] 1900 Locomobile. Owner Leo Regan.

[Picture No. 22:] The 3 cyl. Chase, no ID.

[Picture No. 25:] Can't be positive but think this [Rolls-Royce] PI Ascot belonged to the late Prof. Charles Dufton on the basis of its color.

[Picture No. 28:] Alvis 12-50 of British Team.

[Picture No. 29:] The infamous "Hutton", a 4 cyl. Napier derivative built to take place in a special race in 1908. Driven here by "Steady" Barker and Cecil "Sam" Clutton, legendary veteran car people of G.B.

[Picture No. 31:] The [Rolls-Royce] with [the] victoria top was around a lot, but I have never been able to pin it down. Ditto the high top [Rolls-Royce Limousine] [in Picture No. 32].

[Picture No. 34:] Is a Ford 6 cyl. Model K owned by one John Helden.

[Picture No. 38:] This [was] homebuilt by one Ernest Johnson who was handy man and chauffeur to a lady named Agnes Lyons who was a writer and had a brother who was a priest. They had several cars but only Ernest drove them. I don't think she ever learned how [to drive]. She wrote for me in the "Bulb Horn" or some program at least once. Don't recall what happened to her or her cars. They had a [Pierce-Arrow] and a DeDion Bouton and maybe others. I'm sure the Johnson Special is still around.

Thank you very much. I have added Fred Roe's comments as written to each corresponding photo.

-Jon

Frank, please thank Fred for me for the list. I'm sure he was there. As usual, Fred usually knows...

Which brings up an interesting question. I have tons of old slides my father took of car events in the 50s & 60s. I'm sure a lot of other people do too. Finding time to even look at them is mind-boggling (there are thousands). I'm sure I'm not alone. I hate to lose the history involved in these pictures, but realistically, I don't see to many practical things to do with them. Scanning each one and posting them on the net sounds like a good idea, but not all that practical. Just the time it would take is daunting. Hosting costs money. Unless I set up a trust to pay for the site, it won't be there forever. There must be a better way. Any ideas?

The cost would be too high to try to host photos essentially forever, unless maybe a club took it on (VMCCA???). My alternative for all my photos is to use a site like Flickr that has unlimited storage and is very inexpensive.

In the case of the photos of the cars, I put them under a Creative Commons license (http://creativecommons.org/)that allows them to be distributed and modified without having to ask my permission as long as it is not for profit and they need to be kept under that license and the attribution to my father stays with the photos. What I hope that accomplishes is the photos will get copied, downloaded and used by those that are interested and will essentially live on with or without a website to host them.

I do know someone who spent five years scanning his father's 10,000 or so slides, but he doesn't yet have a means of hosting them. I figure it isn't worth spending the time unless you give them a life of their own. Who knows where they will be hosted 50 years from now?....

I also feel that it is important to collect any info on the photos now while it is available, though with the number of photos you are talking about that could be quite daunting. Again, a community site like Flickr or one hosted privately that would allow anyone to post comments would record a history along with the photos and the work would be shared amoung the many who conributed. This would make the whole task much easier and would provide possibly interesting inputs.

For the small number that I have scanned in I can afford the time to attempt to get accurate and complete descriptions of the photos. I do have some more of my father's photos of automobile events from the 60s and many of my own from the 70s on. I will eventually get to them as well. So thanks again to everyone on the list for the info and please keep it coming.

-Jon

CCCA Friends:

I will consider putting a digital photo hosting area on the VMCCA website and I am sure CCCA or AACA could do the same. The Cadillac La Salle club has a nice one that anyone can upload to. Hosting such pictures does not cost much (we have plenty of space available on our server), although high resolution images could eat up space if this feature became real popular. The problem is getting the pictures properly captioned and digitized.

For now, Jon's pictures have provided entertainment and nostalgia for this forum while gathering important historical facts about these cars, their owners, and this event. Perhaps this trend will continue and others might digitize and submit their collections. This will be fun while helping us preserve some of these images. So if you have any images you'd like to show, take Jon's lead and load them into a site like Flickr for now. I will look into putting a free uploadable site like CLC on the VMCCA Website that forum lurkers could link too to enjoy and comment on.

For undigitized boxes of slides and photos, I hope that some of them end up donated to the CCCA or AACA museums. They might just sit there for years, but someday, some researcher could find them and publish some.

Bill, VMCCA Webmaster

For those that didnt know... the AACA allows posting of unlimited photos at:

http://photos.aaca.org/

Peter

Maybe they want a special section for "antique pictures" such as before 1960....1940...1900???, Peter.

Speak up fellows! What are you in need of that we don't already have already in place?

As an aside, I usually "check and upload" pictures every day. If not every day, every other day. We have to check first to keep out unsuitable pictures. Go to the bottom of the Photo Gallery to view the different groups already set up.

Wayne

I just received a copy of the bulletin of the VSCC from 1957 from the VSCC. This has a day by day diary of both the preparations for the event in England as well as a day by day description of the actual event. It is really fun to read with descriptions of what it was like to dirve the cars as well as how they performed. There is also a lot of great commnetary about driving in New England at the time as well. Great reading! I will be doing another update to the photos as soon as I get some time.

-Jon

The phots are now (mostly) updated with comments written by C. Clutton of the British team from his write-up in the VSCC bulletin from 1957.

-Jon

automuseum -

Not sure of the problem, or if unique to me, but I was unable to open your attachment?

Bob

Bob... Look again, I belive the inserted photo is there now.

Thanks for the heads up.

Roberto